Tuesday, July 10, 2007

The Other Side of Truth - UFO Hall of Shame

Because for every yin there is a yang, and to every season... well, you know how it goes.

UFO Hall of Shame - Who should be inducted first?
Frank Scully
George Adamski
Dr. Seth Shostak
George Van Tassel
Frank Kaufmann
Dr. Steven Greer
Linda Moulton Howe
Silas Newton
Richard Doty
William L. Moore
Philip J. Klass
Gerald Anderson
Ray Santilli
Billy Meier
Bob Lazar
Ed Walters
Todd Zechel
Budd Hopkins
Dr. Edward U. Condon
Marshall Applewhite
Free polls from Pollhost.com
The same rules apply to the Hall of Shame as the Hall of Fame - the top five vote recipients will form the introductory class of 2007. Write-in votes are allowed, either in the comments section or by e-mail to kimballwood@aol.com. One vote per person.

Vox populi.

Paul Kimball

28 comments:

Mac said...

I voted for Shostak -- because out of the bunch he's a guy who should know better but instead chooses to play the selective evidence card.

I notice Korff's not the list, in keeping with your truce, I presume. He's best forgotten.

Null said...

Klass had it all the way till I hit Condon. Although Klass should get special mention on two fronts. One the longest sustained assault and two having his own exotic ufo theory debunked by a ufo researcher. That bit of irony had to sting.
ns

Mac said...

Klass, for all of his belligerence, helped keep ufology honest -- to a point. So I'll give him some credit for that, although I'm certainly not a fan.

Greg Bishop said...

If you're going to put Moore on the "shame" list, he should be on the "fame" one as well. Ditto for Gray Barker.

Since you didn't have Sean Morton on the list, I of course voted for Greer.

Paul Kimball said...

Greg:

I know Moore is a friend of yours, but to suggest he belongs on the "Fame" list is a bit much. Honestly, what do you think he did that would remotely qualify him for that, or excuse his myriad failings and mistakes?

Paul

Hector said...

Is Moore on the list because he really did everything he claimed to Bennewitz, or is he on the list because he fabricated that whole story?

(all I've got to go by is his Wikipedia entry, I'd never heard this story before)

The Odd Emperor said...

Applewhite killed people, nuff said!

Lesley said...

Hector -- I will suggest that you read Greg Bishop's book, "Project Beta."

Paul -- Despite later events, wasn't it Bill Moore who first started breaking the Roswell story with Stanton? I am not saying he deserves to be in the hall of fame or off the hall of shame, but as I remember he did do various things before the whole Bennewitz saga that were noteworthy.

Terry said...

I liked Klass. Nothing wrong with being skeptical.

Why isn't Art on this list? for helping to spread the more dingbat notions in the field? Or Jeff Rense for mixing it in with that other blather he promotes and thus discrediting the field?

Anonymous said...

Amazing thing that Klass and Condon have more votes than Applewhite, who was directly responsible for the deaths of a dozen people.
Kimball, by including Applewhite you made the choice obvious for any reasoned person -- anyone who doesn't choose him over the others has obviously lost contact with reality.
Exclude him, and you may have a more interesting poll.
OTOH, by including him you may show just how much the voters may be insane.

My Eyes said...

I vote for Erich von Daniken !

red pilljunkie said...

You forgot to include Jaime Maussan.

Greg Bishop said...

If you want to include a "myriad of failings and mistakes" as your criteria for "shame," why have John Keel and Gray Barker on your "fame" list? Both made errors, and Keel never changed his opinions when presented with evidence to the contrary. Barker knowingly disseminated false information to sell books.

If, as you seem to be suggesting, "fame" is a measure of both influence and hard work in the field, Moore made the effort to infiltrate the government disinfo game and make ufology aware of this, of which it was blissfully unaware until 1989. Along with Friedman, he also brought a level of research and skepticism to examining released documents, on which he was willing to change his opinion when new information became available. Most researchers crow about their discoveries long after they have been proven to be bogus.

Rod said...

Jeez, Paul - I couldn't even begin to vote on something like that. To start with, it's a toss-up between "deeply misguided" and "total slime," and that's a hard choice from the get -go. Plus: no Salla, no Webre, no Viggiani. What's with that?

Secondly, it's not like Royce is going to add any of these people, anyway. For whatever reason, the Hall of Shame stalled. Sort of like ufology.

Richard Lalancette said...

I have to say, I wasn't impressed to see Dr. Steven Greer in there.

I had the chance to participate to a CSETI Training in 2006, in Mt. Shasta. And it was a life changing experience.

I really don't appreciate the personality trashing without any foundations.

You sir, will need to do your homework, because you are deeply mistaken on Steven.

Richard Lalancette
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

Dr. X said...

Where to begin?

Richard L.--read Greer's "Forbidden Knowledge" with a critical eye and do some research, and see if you feel the same way.

What about Whitley Strieber? He's certainly passed off fiction for "truth." As has Budd Hopkins and David Jacobs.

I'd also add a couple government agencies, like the CIA and the USAF's intelligence branch.

Moore's involvement with Doty and the whole MJ-12 fiction and the Bennewitz affair is sufficient grounds to include old wild Bill.

I voted for Condon--the last best hope for a serious public investigation with government resources at a critical juncture was destroyed by his nearly criminal ignorance, arrogance, manipulation, and denial of the reality of the large percentage of true unknowns in the "Condon" report and he did the worst job imaginable while creating a transparent whitewash as a result.
A tremendous loss at a crucial time.

Unforgivable bastard, IMHO.

The Odd Emperor said...

Terry said...

I liked Klass. Nothing wrong with being skeptical.

What! Yes there is! ;)

Seriously, most proponents of the hysterical branches of Ufology will tell you that Klass was some species of fanatic. Hell bent to discredit and scoff at the "mountains" of evidence proving that aliens routinely visit Earth. Klass for his part steadfastly asserted that there really is no good evidence, that human testimony is not very reliable and hard evidence will be needed to establish the ETH once and for all.

My opinion is that this sort of thinking helps Ufology, even if it tends to filter out most data that ETH proponents think is significant. Anything that prevents Ufology from becoming more of a religion is IMO helpful.

Alfred Lehmberg said...

You know, Mr. Pettingill, for someone as concerned as you have recently demonstrated with regard to privacy, the right to be unhindered in your lawful affairs, the right not to be whisper campaigned and harrassed... Klass was a man employing all those things and more against men so far above him in the evolutionary plane that he was well and _truly_ a reptile in comparison... and even performing a reptilian act at his passing.

I won't mince words, Mr. Pettingill. He drove James McDonald to suicide, tried to deny Stanton Friedman a living AND a place to live, and he employed every possible contrived and duplicitous mechanism he could to keep UFOs from getting a real hearing in the aggregate consciousness of lay society.

Piss on him. No praise for dead sons of bitches here.

He was no constructive curmudgeon. He was no honored opposition. He was no legitimate skeptic. He was a back shooting, corner sniping, hate mongering old bastard and this world is much improved with his passing.

I'm sure Dr. Mengele has a logical booster capable of making a silk purse out of _that_ sow's ear.

alienview@roadrunner.com
> www.AlienView.net
>> AVG Blog -- http://alienviewgroup.blogspot.com/
>>> U F O M a g a z i n e -- www.ufomag.com

The Odd Emperor said...

Alfred Lehmberg said...

"He was no legitimate skeptic. He was a back shooting, corner sniping, hate mongering old bastard and this world is much improved with his passing."

Well Alfred, you and I are a world apart. I don't wish people to die and I do not as a rule delight in the passing of people, even those I dislike.

Saying that Mr. Lehmberg; you seem to be well on the way to resemble your very own description of Mr. Klass, albeit in a less skeptical sense.

Alfred Lehmberg said...

Way to go so deliciously and predictably personal, Mr. Pettingill. The ball thuds down, decidedly, on your side of the net, eh? Humiliatingly so, when you think about it. You don't want to argue the irreducible injustice and civil rights abuse(can't actually) and so are forced into a reducible (if flaccid) AH upon myself. Lovely.

Kudos, though, on getting my address half correct, and refraining from your usual denial with regard to being Mr. Pettingill, at all.

As to your weak and insipid, too convenient, and so specious charge? Taste is in your mouth only, Mr. Pettingill. I'm in that world "apart" from you, after all, and confidently comfortable there. How terrible for you that you are not.

alienview@roadrunner.com
> www.AlienView.net
>> AVG Blog -- http://alienviewgroup.blogspot.com/
>>> U F O M a g a z i n e -- www.ufomag.com

Paul Kimball said...

A.L. and O.E. -

Enough!

I've said it before, and I'll say it again - if you guys want to have at each other, do it at your own blogs / sites. Please.

Further personal attacks / comments won't be published.

Paul Kimball

The Odd Emperor said...

I apologize Paul; Mr. L and I don't need to be bickering here.

Mr. Lehmberg can always contact me if he likes and he can comment the Odd Empire weblog for the time being.

OE
http://oddempire.org

Paul Kimball said...

OE:

I don't mind you and Mr. Lehmberg "bickering" here, so long as it's about substantive issues. What I object to are personal attacks / bickering. Nothing useful comes of that, and everyone involved looks bad. It's one of the reasons I called a "truce" with Kal Korff - because I found that I couldn't engage with him on a substantive level, and I was getting dragged into the personal stuff, which, contrary to popular opinion, I don't like or enjoy.

Anyway, no harm, no foul.

Paul

Alfred Lehmberg said...

"I apologize Paul; Mr. L and I don't need to be bickering here."

Well... we did actually. Paul Kimball's board has some small notoriety and popularity and is read by the critical. It was on that board... where you made an assertion with smug confidence and comfortable sincerity that Philip Klass was in any way a positive force in Ufology.

That is a position that I cannot allow to stand without contention, as my recollection of history is nowhere near what you had laid out for same.

We differ, Sir, and that difference needed explication where what provoked it was proposed.

I appreciate Mr. Kimball's indulgence in the matter.

alienview@roadrunner.com
> www.AlienView.net
>> AVG Blog -- http://alienviewgroup.blogspot.com/
>>> U F O M a g a z i n e -- www.ufomag.com

binnall said...

Paul :

Professional wrestling legend Bruno Sammartino says that "if a Hall of Fame doesn't have an actual building, then it isn't a real Hall of Fame".

How do you respond to these allegations ?

Signed,
a concerned voter

Anonymous said...

I vote for Paul Kimball due to his lack of originality (who doesn't have a "top ten list" nowadays?) and his lack of research (his films are just the same ol' stories we've heard before with nothing new to them) in his films.

Paul Kimball said...

Speaking of a lack of originality, it's "Anonymous", with his jealous trolling.

Still, a vote is a vote.

name: SG said...

This is a tough call. I can't help but feel naive for wondering if the better half of this list don't deserve such a scathing award. Anonymous does have a point about Applegate (Though he/she doesn't have to be belligerent about it).
Santilli is another who's name shouldn't be mentioned when discussing ufos.
Shostak would probably relish the thought of being on this list.

I think this award is best served to Condon. Unlike the others on the list, he was in position of authority and influence; endorsed by the Air Force and a representative of a concerned public. The results of "The Condon Report" is report is not only legendary, but a most disturbing disapointment.